Traveller-digest     Saturday, October 16 1999     Volume 1999 : Number 1218



(R)1996. Traveller is a registered trademark of FarFuture Enterprises.
All rights reserved.

The following topics are covered in this digest:

Re: Intelligent Infantry
Re: FLASH: J. Andrew Keith is dead. 
Re: FLASH: J. Andrew Keith is dead.
Re: GT Task System
Re: GT Task System
Re: GTL9 5 dTon Shuttle
Re: Traveller Player Roster (was Players in Clearwater Florida?)
RE: PBeM campaigns versus creative writing
Re: FLASH: J. Andrew Keith is dead.
Re: PBeM TCS Islands Campaign: Interested?
Re: GT Task System
Great Task Debate
Re: The Nth Traveller Flamewar
re: FFW Players out there?
Re: PBeM TCS Islands Campaign: Factions?
Re: Intelligent Infantry
Re: SEC: UNCLASSIFIED: Out of ammo alert
Re: FLASH: J. Andrew Keith is dead.
Re: Norris the Man...

----------------------------------------------------------------------

Date: Sat, 16 Oct 1999 13:45:59 EDT
From: RASFranzen@aol.com
Subject: Re: Intelligent Infantry

 j_pete@bellsouth.net:

<< I don't disagree with you. Intelligent soldiers have been better
 soldiers ever since volley fire tactics became impractical. There are
 still many knotheads around. Ft. Bragg was inundated with them. It
 appears to me the more intelligent (or educated) recruits are pulled
 towards the technical jobs.
  >>

Actually there are studies about distribution of intelligence and performance 
in the US Army. If I remember them correctly intelligent soldiers improved 
infantry performance - but the number of intelligent men in the infantry had 
declined from WWII to Korea.
After all any dummy can be sent to the front, but it takes some brainsto 
operate artillery systems, even though of course loaders did not need to be 
Einsteins. Luckily these are being  replaced by autoloaders.
best wishes
Soenke Franzen
( National Service in Counter Battery 1982 - 1983)

------------------------------

Date: Sat, 16 Oct 1999 14:48:43 -0000
From: "Chris Seamans" <semo@pil.net>
Subject: Re: FLASH: J. Andrew Keith is dead. 

- -----Original Message-----
From: Keven R. Pittsinger <jamstar@accesstoledo.com>
To: traveller@lists.imagiconline.com <traveller@lists.imagiconline.com>
Date: Saturday, October 16, 1999 5:24 PM
Subject: Re: FLASH: J. Andrew Keith is dead.


>Well, there might be some truth to the rumour that there *are* Traveller
>games in the afterlife.  I just wish Andy haddn't been tapped to be the
guest
>GM for awhile...


Very well said, Keven.

------------------------------

Date: Sat, 16 Oct 1999 14:12:14 -0500
From: "Smart, David J (David)" <dasmart@lucent.com>
Subject: Re: FLASH: J. Andrew Keith is dead.

> gridlore@pop.mindspring.com posted:
> 
> << <raises glass> To J. Andrew Keith, one of the original voices of
Traveller 
> >>
> 
> To absent friends....:-(

Amen.

Damn. This really sucks.

His creativity provided many, many hours of happiness in the lives of
people across the world (including mine). Very few people can say that.

My condolences, Paul, to you and the Keith family.

David

------------------------------

Date: Sat, 16 Oct 1999 15:18:05 -0400 (EDT)
From: Robert Prior <robert_prior@sympatico.ca>
Subject: Re: GT Task System

>Robert Prior writes:
>>
>> MegaTraveller had Simple, Routine, Difficult, Formidable, and Impossible.
>
>First, let's give descriptions of what we think these mean:
>Simple: can reasonably be done by someone unskilled, with trial and error.
>Routine: can be done by anyone trained to moderate competency.  An expert
>will do it right almost every time.
>Difficult: Someone with moderate training would be lucky to do this at
>all.  An expert might require multiple attempts.
>Formidable: only an expert has a chance at this one, and not a great chance.
>'Impossible': only someone of exceptional skill has even a chance of
>accomplishing this task.
>
>Given GURPS meanings, those would be:
>Simple: +5 (most people can default and succeed)
>Routine: +0 (anyone skill 10+ will probably succeed eventually)
>Difficult: -5 (an expert, with skill 16+, may need multiple attempts)
>Formidable: -10 (someone who is brilliant, with 20- skill, might fail)
>Impossible: -15 (in a realistic setting, skills above 20 basically don't
>occur, so no-one has a significant chance of success).

Hm.I think you're overestimating the difficulty of the tasks. In
MegaTraveller, skill level 3+ is professional, with a further 1-2 bonus for
stat. This means that a "professional" would have at least +4 on all tasks;
an "expert" would have a skill level of 5+, and very possibly a high enough
stat to get +2, so an "expert" would get about +6 or +7.  All of these on a
2d roll, of course.

A "Routine" task succeeds on 7+. A professional would need only 3+ (on 2d)
to succeed - the best odds they could get anyway (as 2 is automatic
failure). A "Difficult" task requires 11+, so for a professional that's
about 7+, and for an expert that's about 4+ or 5+.

You also had the option of doing a task "cautiously", which made the task a
level easier (assuming that you first passed a determination roll). In my
group, most people did Formidable tasks this way, and often the Difficult
ones as well.

Anyway, back to GT. If an expert has a skill level of 16+, what about a
professional? (Ie. what is the difference between a competent doctor and a
world-famous one?)

------------------------------

Date: Sat, 16 Oct 1999 15:18:11 -0400 (EDT)
From: Robert Prior <robert_prior@sympatico.ca>
Subject: Re: GT Task System

>On note when looking at stats.  My experience is that most characters
>will be up around at 16 in their best skills.  Many, esp. after
>they have gotten some experience, will have numbers around 17-18 (exp for
>mental skills).  I think you will see specialized character (and a few more
>"dedicated" players :-) in the up to 20 range.
>
>So if you think the best of PCs should suceed at an "impossible"
>task 25% of the time, then one would go with a -12 (or that was
>my reasoning at least....)

Ah, I'd disagree with this.

An "Impossible" task should be just that, very nearly impossible. In MT
terms it meant rolling 19+ on 2d, so even with an expert skill level (4-5)
and lots of stat (10+ giving a +2 dm) you'd still have to roll 11+ or 12+
to succeed. The solution, of course, was to use things like cautious task
rolls to reduce the task from "Impossible" to "Formidable".

I haven't run the numbers yet, but the BITS spread (+/- 3 steps) looks
pretty reasonable to me.

As to skill levels, would this be a reasonable description of GURPS skill
levels?

Amateur or beginner (11-)
Journeyman (12-14)
Professional (15-16)
Expert (17-18)
World-renowned expert (19+)

------------------------------

Date: Sat, 16 Oct 1999 20:38:12 +0100
From: John Buston <John.Buston@tesco.net>
Subject: Re: GTL9 5 dTon Shuttle

>But I wanted more than a couple hours of flight time.  
>They may make runs to a trojan point or to the 100D limit 
>or just about anywhere else.

With 1 days limited life support? You're braver than you look :) 

With 0.656G acceleration, Earths 100D and back is a 16 hours round trip, plus
another hour for reaching orbit and landing, plus whatever time you spend at the
100D. Not much safety margin.

Personally I would want full life support if at any point I am exceeding escape
velocity.

Which trojan points? Not that many planets have nearby trojan/lagrange points,
and gas giant trojans are way out. 

You also only have a 100,000 mile communicator, cramped seats and no bunks or
toilets. I wouldn't want to go that far in it. Perhaps it could be a mustering
out benefit for an x-boat pilot ;-)

------------------------------

Date: Sat, 16 Oct 99 13:54:29 -0500
From: "Eris Reddoch" <eris@pcola.gulf.net>
Subject: Re: Traveller Player Roster (was Players in Clearwater Florida?)

On 10/16/99 at 08:35 AM,  "Benyamene' ZeAbe' Akella" <xrp@sierratel.com> said:

>> To help fellow Traveller find each other, I am maintaining a roster
>> of Traveller players and GMs at my website.  If you are a Traveller
>> player or GM and you want to be listed in the roster send me an
>> email with the following information:
>>
>> Name, City, State/Province, Country, optional url, optional email
>>
>> You can view the current roster at:
>>
>>   http://crosswinds.net/~erisr
>>
>> Eris

>Jesse and Evyn, prerhaps some others, but I'm still on my first
>mug-o-coffee, are listed with the "old school" Ca instead of CA. Do
>you hate me for pointing that out? Will you bother to fix it? 

Hee, yes I'll fix it when I made some other addition/corrections
this afternoon.  When I was putting the info up, I gave up trying to
be completely consistant and mostly just did cut and paste.  I was
sure I'd hear from people about whatever I got wrong.  Of course,
once I do I'll start hearing from our Canadian friends...<g>

Eris
- -- 
- -----------------------------------------------------------
"Eris Reddoch" <eris@pcola.gulf.net>    using MR/2 ICE #245
- -----------------------------------------------------------

------------------------------

Date: Sat, 16 Oct 99 14:38:34 -0500
From: "Eris Reddoch" <eris@pcola.gulf.net>
Subject: RE: PBeM campaigns versus creative writing

On 10/16/99 at 10:10 AM,  "Jesse DeGraff" <fenris@slip.net> said:

>There's also apparently different STYLES of PBEM play.  Month long
>turns in a PBEM?  I'm in two by Roger Barr and we usually have
>traffic and action DAILY on each.  

Yes, that's true.  There are different styles of play and different
types of games called PBEM.

With only an occasional slow day, my AKUS PBEM averages close to a
dozen posts a day.  Carlos and Keven's games are as active.  The
thing that these three games have in common, other than good
players, great GMs (not including myself, of course), and very
interactive plots is that they focus on *roleplaying*.
Additionally, there are no set turns and the posts go directly to
the players without constant moderation (we GMs *do* step in to
maintain flow from time to time), this keeps the games flowing and
*hopefully* keeps the player's interest high.  The downside is that
the play is somewhat chaotic and players can get lost in the plot,
it's sometimes hard for slow posters to effectivly contribute, and
there is continious pressure on the GM because he isn't having
sessions once a week, he's running sessions *every* day.

Another style has all players react to a "turn" sent out by the GM
within a set timeframe.  The GM collects these posts, puts them
together, determines what happened and posts the results of that
turn, followed by the next turn.  I've been in this style game in
the past and it can work well if the time between turns isn't too
long and the GM is very good at creating compelling narratives in
his results and turn posts.  OTOH, in many cases, the players are
pretty isolatied from one another with the GM being a buffer
(sometimes a barrier) or the time between posts gets so long that
games can bog down and fade out as players lose interest.

You can mix these two styles, too.  For example, I sometimes give my
AKUS people a "turn" where they tell me what they are doing for an
entire day (or week) and we handle that entire period with a
consolidating post.  On the other side, a "turn" based game may slip
into "interactive" mode (or go to IRC) for the big showdown scenes
where the action will be fast and furious.

Games that don't emphasise roleplaying, TCS/FFW type games, work
better with a "turn" based system.  Have firm deadlines and
procedures if a player doesn't make a deadline.  Don't make the
turns too far apart, I'd really try for no less than one a week,
say...Result/New Turn goes out from the GM on Sunday and and replies
must be back to the GM by 6am Saturday morning.  That gives the GM
two days to evaluate replies, figure results and get the Results and
New Turn post off, and it gives the players five days to make their
next turn.

>There's usually only a lull if
>Roger's unavailable, like a couple of weeks ago when he went on
>vacation and came back to Hurricane what's-it's-name that luckily
>drifted north of him and instead tore up South Carolina.

And he might get a brush with Irene this weekend too, so keep an eye on
the Weather Channel.

Eris

- -- 
- -----------------------------------------------------------
"Eris Reddoch" <eris@pcola.gulf.net>    using MR/2 ICE #245
- -----------------------------------------------------------

------------------------------

Date: Sat, 16 Oct 99 14:48:20 -0500
From: "Eris Reddoch" <eris@pcola.gulf.net>
Subject: Re: FLASH: J. Andrew Keith is dead.

On 10/14/99 at 03:11 PM,  Jerry Paul Sanders <timmon@primenet.com> said:

>I am in shock. Today I received a letter from William H. Keith Jr.
>informing me that his brother J. Andrew Keith died  on August 7th. 

Let me add my condolences to all the others.  This is a great loss
for us all, to lose a talent so great at such a young age.  

Paul, if you are in contact with the Keith family please add my
expressions of sympathy for their loss and my best wishes in their
time of mourning.
Eris
- -- 
- -----------------------------------------------------------
"Eris Reddoch" <eris@pcola.gulf.net>    using MR/2 ICE #245
- -----------------------------------------------------------

------------------------------

Date: Sat, 16 Oct 1999 16:14:30 -0400
From: "DaveShayne" <daveshayne@email.msn.com>
Subject: Re: PBeM TCS Islands Campaign: Interested?

>Date: Fri, 15 Oct 1999 20:25:53 -0700
>From: "Mark S Peace" <mark.s.peace@dunelm.org.uk>
>Subject: Re: PBeM TCS Islands Campaign: Interested?
>
>If you run an Island clusters campaign, any of the main players would suit
>me - how about Sansterre?.  Probably best to avoid 'New Home'.  I don't
>imagine the 1 higher TL is enough to compensate for the much lower
>population.  (Are there any population multipliers published for Island
>Clusters, or are the populations all 100mil, 1bil, 10 bil etc?)

These figures are OTTOMH not published that I'm aware of but how about
Pop multiples of 9 for New Home, 1 for Esperanza, and 3 for all the other
majors this gives a consistent 3.33 ratio between the populations.

<snip>

>Mark.


>- -----Original Message-----
>>Date: Thu, 14 Oct 1999 19:47:29 +0100
>>From: "Matthew Bond" <mgb@akira.swinternet.co.uk>
>>Subject: PBeM TCS Islands Campaign: Interested?
>>

<snip>

>>Let me know preferred faction when you get in touch, as I'll try to
>>accommodate where possible.

Esperanza would be my first choice but I'm willing to play
New Home if nobody else wants it. (I likes me challenges)

David Shayne

daveshayne@msn.com

------------------------------

Date: Sat, 16 Oct 99 15:34:21 -0500
From: "Eris Reddoch" <eris@pcola.gulf.net>
Subject: Re: GT Task System

On 10/16/99 at 03:18 PM,  Robert Prior <robert_prior@sympatico.ca> said:

David said..
>>On note when looking at stats.  My experience is that most characters
>>will be up around at 16 in their best skills.  Many, esp. after
>>they have gotten some experience, will have numbers around 17-18 (exp for
>>mental skills).  I think you will see specialized character (and a few more
>>"dedicated" players :-) in the up to 20 range.

I know you are correct about what *happens*, but I don't think you
are right if you think that *should* happen.  If you look at the
numbers...and the guidelines in Basic...you see that 16 for IQ is
considered *genius* and expert level for skills.  Don't throw the
weapons levels at me either, those are appropriate for a heroic
fantasy games, but, IMO, not for Traveller.  I'm going to throw one
of the GURPSite's favorite terms at you, <g> "balance", skill levels
of 20, or even routinely in the upper teens, are unbalancing for the
*Traveller* universe (at least in MTU they would be).

IMO, Traveller PC's are only "a cut above average", *not* supermen.
They are heroes because of *what* they do, not because of their high
Stats or Skills.  Their Stats should range from 8 to 14, and that 14
is after all advancement.  Their *best* one or two skills should be
15 to 17, their average professional skills should be 12 to 14, and
their other skills should vary from 8 to 12.  Very, very rarely
should you see an 18+ for any skill, and then only in some narrow
specialty and only if the PC has disadvantaged himself in other
areas.  As for advancement, that should be *very* slow once past 15,
taking *years and years* of experience, and should be mostly offset
by aging penalties.

>>So if you think the best of PCs should suceed at an "impossible"
>>task 25% of the time, then one would go with a -12 (or that was
>>my reasoning at least....)

>Ah, I'd disagree with this.

>An "Impossible" task should be just that, very nearly impossible. 
<snip>

I agree., aybe the *very* best skill of a *very* rare PC, but we're
talking about a one in ten thousand case.  Impossible *should* be
virtually impossible...and Hopeless shouldn't be much easier. <g>

>I haven't run the numbers yet, but the BITS spread (+/- 3 steps)
>looks pretty reasonable to me.

Rob, I did and they are pretty reasonable *if* skills don't inflate
beyond the ranges I listed above.  If skills start getting routinely
into the upper teens and twenties then virtually Impossible tasks
begin to get too easy.

>As to skill levels, would this be a reasonable description of GURPS
>skill levels?

Personally, I'd drop the scale just a little...

>Amateur or beginner (11-)       (10-)
>Journeyman (12-14)              (11-13)
>Professional (15-16)            (14-15)
>Expert (17-18)                  (16)
>World-renowned expert (19+)     (17)
 Best in the Subsector           (18)
 Best in the Sector              (19)
 Best in the Imperium            (20)
 An Asimov "mule"                (21+)

I'm as tough on Stat inflation as I am on grade inflation. <g>

Eris
- -- 
- -----------------------------------------------------------
"Eris Reddoch" <eris@pcola.gulf.net>    using MR/2 ICE #245
- -----------------------------------------------------------

------------------------------

Date: Sat, 16 Oct 1999 16:48:59 -0400 (EDT)
From: "William F. Hostman" <aramis@gci.net>
Subject: Great Task Debate

><tongue-in-cheek>
>That being the case, how well did you like the original Marvel Super
>Hero system by TSR, the one where *everything* was put into descriptive
>terms? If I remember the progression correctly (it's been a while),
>it went: Feeble, Typical, Good, Excellent, Remarkable, Incredible,
>Amazing, Monstrous, Unearthly. So an easy task (opening an unlocked
>door) would require a roll against the Feeble or Typical column,
>while a really hard one (flying at full speed through an asteroid
>field while being chased by a fleet of enemy fighters -- blindfolded)
>would be Monstrous or Unearthly. Think we could adapt this to Traveller?
></tongue-in-cheek>
>
Marvel was skill based, not task based... the labels defined skill levels,
not difficulties. So hard tasks were shifted x collums towards feeble, and
easy towars shift x/ShiftZ (Marvel, Adv MarveL).

The fundamental difference between skill based systems and task based
systems is
Item		Skill Based		Task Based
Target number	Skill level		task difficulty
Mods apply to	Skill level		task roll*

Or, should I say, most task systems adjust the roll, rather than the TN
(BP, StarPlay, several others). A few use variable numbers of dice for
difficulties...and really are hybrids.

In a skill based system, each skill has a target number of it's own, and
you modify the target number to find the actual target number for the
action. Examples D&D/AD&D, Palladium, Chaosium (Both BRP asnd Pendragon
Engines), STRPG (by FASA).

Most task systems have set target numbers by difficulty, which you need to
meet or beat to succeed, including MT, StarPlay, BabProj, Star Wars,
WoD/StoryTeller, LUGTrek, CP2020, Mekton/MZ, Rolemaster/Spacemaster

Some hybrids use a skill target number with difficulty level variables:
TNE, T2K 1s & 2d eds, James Bond RPG,  and IIRC, Mythus.


William F. Hostman  |  "Smith & Wesson: THe original Point and Click
interface!"
Aramis 0602 C55A364-C S kk+ as+ hi+ dr+ va++(--) so+ zh++ vi+ da++ sy- ge-
533
Mailto:aramis@gci.net http://home.gci.net/~aramis http://www.alaska.net/~mhaa
ICQ:14640742          AIM:AKAramis	ARM 1.0: 3 R H++ P+
IMTU 1.0: tc tm++ tn- t4-- tt+ to- tg-- ru+ ge 3i+ c+ jt-() au+ st- ls
pi+() ta+ he+(-) kk+ as+ hi+ dr+ va++(--) so+ zh++ vi+ da++ sy- ge- pi+

------------------------------

Date: Sun, 17 Oct 1999 11:51:09 +1300
From: "Frank Pitt" <frankie@mundens.gen.nz>
Subject: Re: The Nth Traveller Flamewar

> The ease of metric is exagerated.  One doesn't really convert that
> much in English Units.  You generally just stick with the unit that
> are convenient.

You obviously haven't studied physics. 
Try doing that in Imperial units, or even American units. 

How many horsepower metres are there in an erg mile again ?
<grin>

Frankie

------------------------------

Date: Sat, 16 Oct 1999 21:01:44 -0400
From: "Walter G. Smith" <smithw@hartwick.edu>
Subject: re: FFW Players out there?

Leonard Erikson wrote:
>>>>>>>>
Actually, you only get real time chat if you are at the same *planet*.
Otherwise the lag is simply too long.

You can send email between planets, with delays on a par with current
internet mail. But *talking* requires a lag of no more than a few
seconds. And that's a *miniscule* distance in space.
>>>>>>>>
I agree that actual "talking" will be problematic, but in comparison to
the kinds of information lags parsecs will cause, and in-system real-time 
chat window (in a game context) shouldn't be too much of an abstraction.

Besides, in Trillion Credit Squadron, all the ships in the star system
are within combat range of each other. They should be able to talk. ;-)

Walt Smith

------------------------------

Date: Sun, 17 Oct 1999 02:10:28 +0100
From: "Matthew Bond" <mgb@akira.swinternet.co.uk>
Subject: Re: PBeM TCS Islands Campaign: Factions?

- -----Original Message-----
From: DaveShayne <daveshayne@email.msn.com>
To: traveller@lists.imagiconline.com <traveller@lists.imagiconline.com>
Date: 16 October 1999 21:12
Subject: Re: PBeM TCS Islands Campaign: Interested?
>>From: "Mark S Peace" <mark.s.peace@dunelm.org.uk>
>>Subject: Re: PBeM TCS Islands Campaign: Interested?
>>
>>If you run an Island clusters campaign, any of the main players would suit
>>me - how about Sansterre?.  Probably best to avoid 'New Home'.  I don't
>>imagine the 1 higher TL is enough to compensate for the much lower
>>population.  (Are there any population multipliers published for Island
>>Clusters, or are the populations all 100mil, 1bil, 10 bil etc?)
>
>These figures are OTTOMH not published that I'm aware of but how about
>Pop multiples of 9 for New Home, 1 for Esperanza, and 3 for all the other
>majors this gives a consistent 3.33 ratio between the populations.


I'm happy to go along with this if all the players who expressed an interest
(you know who you are are) are content.  Steven Hudson has been kind enough
to forward me some comments and rules from the TCS game that Donald McKinney
is running (thanks Steven), which I am perusing at the moment. Donald's
ruling was 8, 2, 5 for the pop multipliers (TCS is pre extended UWP's), but
I think I prefer your suggestion.

>>Mark.
>
>
>>- -----Original Message-----
>>>Date: Thu, 14 Oct 1999 19:47:29 +0100
>>>From: "Matthew Bond" <mgb@akira.swinternet.co.uk>
>>>Subject: PBeM TCS Islands Campaign: Interested?
>>>
>
><snip>
>
>>>Let me know preferred faction when you get in touch, as I'll try to
>>>accommodate where possible.
>
>Esperanza would be my first choice but I'm willing to play
>New Home if nobody else wants it. (I likes me challenges)

>
>David Shayne
>
>daveshayne@msn.com

Heh! These are the same choices I made in an abortive FTF TCS game that
never actually got started, nigh on 15 years ago.  Esperanza is rich but
hampered by lower tech, New Home (relatively) poor but with bleeding edge
technology... Ooooh! Desicions, desicions <g>.

Your preferences are duly noted (as is Mark's).  As there are currently only
six interested parties (and one who would like to 'Lurk') the chances are
good that poeple will get their first choice.
I emailed the various parties involved with their 'precedence' number, so if
the others would like to send me an email with their preference for faction
(in order of preference in case of ties), I'll work out who gets to be
which, and let you all know your starting budgets.

Please note that ALL designs must be approved by ICSSSI, the Island Cluster
Starship Standards and Safety Inspectorate (ie Me!). Also note that only Bk5
High Guard 2nd edition designs are allowed (no Bk2 Starships shenanigans...
J-6 at TL9, my ar*e!).

I will also be toning down the money from a Cr500 per capita Naval tax to
something nearer Cr100.  The rest gets spent on training, shore
installations, provisions, pay, pensions, naval bases etc, and thus on 20%
or so is available for actual construction and maintenance of vessels.  As I
said earlier, I'll let players know their exact available budgets soon.


Matt

Matthew Bond
mgb@akira.swinternet.co.uk
www.akira.swinternet.co.uk/strom.html
- --------------------------------------------------------------
"To strike a man who insults you is one thing...
...To run him through with a sword is quite another!"
- --------------------------------------------------------------

------------------------------

Date: Sat, 16 Oct 1999 18:00:57
From: "Douglas E. Berry" <gridlore@pop.mindspring.com>
Subject: Re: Intelligent Infantry

At 01:45 PM 10/16/1999 EDT, you wrote:

>in the US Army. If I remember them correctly intelligent soldiers improved 
>infantry performance - but the number of intelligent men in the infantry had 
>declined from WWII to Korea.

Actually, studies done in the eighties showed that the more intelligent
recruits were more likely to go combat arms.  The studies concluded that
these recruits were look for adventure rather than college money and job
skills.  I can honestly say that I met some very sharp people as a grunt,
and only a limited number of dimbulbs.

>After all any dummy can be sent to the front, but it takes some brainsto 
>operate artillery systems, even though of course loaders did not need to be 
>Einsteins. Luckily these are being  replaced by autoloaders.

And who calls in that artillery, has to be able to discern between over
fifty different types of armored vehicles (and know how to kill half of
them with two different weapons systems?), be able to generate usable
intelligence reports, and do all of this while people are trying *real
hard* to kill you?  The infantry.

These days of the dumb grunt with a rifle died during WWII.  Today,
infantry is as much a mental challenge as a physical one.
- -- 

Douglas E. Berry       gridlore@mindspring.com
http://gridlore.home.mindspring.com/index.html

Embrace Fascism.    The uniforms look cool

------------------------------

Date: Sun, 17 Oct 1999 11:22:06 +1000
From: "Alan Bradley" <alanb@elf.brisnet.org.au>
Subject: Re: SEC: UNCLASSIFIED: Out of ammo alert

> From: Sethkimmel@aol.com
> In a message dated 10/16/99 3:24:00 AM !!!First Boot!!!,
> j_pete@bellsouth.net writes:
> 
> << What happens when the weapons are smarter than the operators? There
>  are unfortunately a large number on knotheads who are PBI's. >>
> 
> Then we go back to the 18th. Century's small professional army (though we
> are almost there already). The armies get smaller as they get more
> expensive (in this case the cost of extra training, extra payroll and
> benefits, and recruitment costs to attract higher educated PBI's - the
> charge of the college brigade!, or Joe Haldeman called it right...).

All this ignores the fact that most armies spend their time in internal
security/repression style activities, where gadgets are _relatively_
secondary, and PBIs with rifles are relatively important.  And that's only
considering the armies of recognised states.  Their opponents are usually
more or less guerillas, or distinctly undertrained militias.

The small professional armies are only those of a minority of countries. 
Somalia and Vietnam suggest that they aren't necessarily all that superior
either, when it comes to a clash, at least in terms of actually achieving
the political goals of the conflict.

OBTRAV:  The Rebellion sourcebook had a brief mention of "popular forces"
being involved in the Rebellion, but there wasn't much else on it.  Apart
from that, Broadsword had some sketchy details on the Tanoose Freedom
League guerillas.

An interesting Mercenary style game would be for the players to be cadres
for popular forces fighting against a regular/mercenary force.  The players
would then be the ones lurking in the piranha-leech infested swamps, while
the Astroburger Legion hunt them from the comfort of airconditioned
g-carriers.  Fun fun fun!

Alan Bradley
alanb@elf.brisnet.org.au

------------------------------

Date: Sun, 17 Oct 1999 11:14:01 +1000
From: "Alan Bradley" <alanb@elf.brisnet.org.au>
Subject: Re: FLASH: J. Andrew Keith is dead.

To absent friends.... 

Alan Bradley
alanb@elf.brisnet.org.au

------------------------------

Date: Sun, 17 Oct 1999 11:19:52 +1000
From: "Alan Bradley" <alanb@elf.brisnet.org.au>
Subject: Re: Norris the Man...

> From: SD Mooney and various people.

> "Alan Bradley" <alanb@elf.brisnet.org.au> writes:
> >*calibration points are fuel caches in interstellar space, usually owned
by
> >the Navy, and not available to, and kept secret from, civilian users. 
They
> >get used heavily in Regency Sourcebook, and, I gather, in Arrival
> >Vengeance.  Of course, in some Traveller games it's not possible to do
deep
> >space jumps like this.
> 
> Isn't it both CT (Traveller Adventure), MT (Arrival Vengeance), TNE
> (Regency Sourcebook) and T4 (Pocket Empires) canon that deep space jumps
> are possible?

Yes, of course it is, but I remember someone on the list having a
brainspasm about it, and I was letting people like this deal with their own
problems.  

Basically, this was a passing comment of no consequence.

Alan Bradley
alanb@elf.brisnet.org.au

------------------------------

End of Traveller-digest V1999 #1218
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